Morning Walk
Prabhupāda: ...at the lotus feet of Nitāi. Nitāi-pāda-kamala, koṭi candra suśītala. Because the shelter is so cool, a thousand times cooler than the moon. Where is that..., Yaśomatīnandana? He is not here? Yesterday he met Mādhava Mahārāja. So he had some talks. [chuckles] In that talk he mentioned that "Your Guru Mahārāja was previously a businessman, so... And we are, from our childhood, we are Vaiṣṅava. So therefore he is doing business and getting money."
Devotees: Whew.
Harikeśa: Kick him on the face.
Prabhupāda: [chuckles] No, don't say like that. But the thing is... Business means... Business means four things. Yes, we are businessman. I was student of economics. I know how to do business, and the business principle means you require four things: land, labor, capital, organization. So ordinary man cannot do that. Otherwise, everyone would have done some business and become millionaires. But it requires these four things: land, labor, organization and capital. So where you have got these? You have neither land, neither capital, neither place. So how you can do business? I am doing business because I have got all these things. I went to America—land. Then I worked—labor. Then I earned some capital, and I have got brain how to do it. [to Lokanātha:] Hare Kṛṣṅa. So why you are becoming paramahaṁsa? Eh? This is paramahaṁsa dress.
Lokanātha: Yeah, I have to dye it today.
Devotee: I told him I'd give him the dye.
Prabhupāda: Don't become paramahaṁsa immediately. Paramahaṁsa is the last stage of sannyāsa. First stage is kuṭicaka. Second stage is parivrājakācārya. Third stage is... No, first stage is kuṭicaka. Then second stage is bahudaka, bahudaka. And third stage is parivrājakācārya, and fourth stage is paramahaṁsa. Therefore paramahaṁsa stage is the topmost.
Lokanātha: They have got white? Do they wear white?
Prabhupāda: They are not under any rule and regulation, paramahaṁsa. Paramahaṁsa means... Just like mlecchas and yavanas, they are not under any rules and regulation, similarly, a paramahaṁsa is also not under any rules and regulation. He can do whatever he likes. Śāstra is not meant for him. Avadhūta. He is not in the material world. Mahābhāva. So that is the last stage of sannyāsa. Kuṭicaka means when from family life, vānaprastha, and then one takes sannyāsa, that is kuṭicaka. Kuṭicaka means he does not remain at home but goes outside home, outside the village area, and makes a kuṭi, cottage, and lives there. But because he is not accustomed to beg, from his house some foodstuff is sent. Just like you are sending to that Sharma some food? This is kuṭicaka. But after some time, when he's little experienced, then he goes from door to door: "Give me a piece of bread." Madhukārī. Madhukāra. Madhukāra means the bee, honeybee. What is called?
Harikeśa: Bumblebee.
Prabhupāda: Bumblebee. He collects little honey here, little honey there, wherever... And not one place so much honey. So this is called bahudaka. Not to collect lump sum food from anywhere. To any gṛhastha a sannyāsī can go: "Please give me a little piece of bread." So that is not difficult. "All right, take." Because many sannyāsī may come, so it is not burden, little piece. So as soon as it is sufficient piece, that's all. It is called bahudaka. Then, when he's further experienced, then preaching country to country, place to place, go on preaching. That is parivrājakācārya. And when he has sufficiently preached, then he can sit down anywhere. That is paramahaṁsa. [shenai playing in background] [break] ...system. In every big temple there is shenai. All through the year, morning, night. Not only temple; rich man's house. And they are so nice player that early in the morning, people, the resident, will rise by hearing the shenai. And at night they will go to bed and sleep hearing the shenai.
Jayapatāka: So that early in morning and late at night.
Prabhupāda: No, other time also. But this time especially.
Lokanātha: They also used to keep cock, hens and the cock, cock early in the morning.
Prabhupāda: Yes. [break] What is called? Alarm bell. Cocks. "Ka-kaa-ka: Get up please." "Ka-kaa-ka." Nature's alarm.
Gurukṛpā: Sometimes they crow, though, at twelve o'clock at night.
Prabhupāda: Just to cheat you, because you sleep more. [laughter] Because you sleep more, to cheat you. You do not rise early in the morning; therefore they are engaged sometimes to cheat you. [break] ...found a very nice house in London. Jayatīrtha is going to take the credit of purchasing it.
Tamāla Kṛṣṅa: Yeah, we found a very nice house in London, and you're going to get the credit for purchasing it. Just see.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Jayatīrtha: Well, if Kṛṣṅa desires.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Everything Kṛṣṅa does, but one takes credit. That's it.
Jayatīrtha: Yes. We think that we're the doer, but actually Kṛṣṅa is the doer.
Prabhupāda: Harer nāma [Cc Ādi 17.21].
[In this Age of Kali there is no other means, no other means, no other means for self-realization than chanting the holy name, chanting the holy name, chanting the holy name of Lord Hari.]
Tamāla Kṛṣṅa: There's been a feeling that all year their hard work has all become worthwhile simply by coming here.
Prabhupāda: Hmm. Yes. Make it more... Therefore I wanted first of all this house, not the temple, because where they'll stay? They'll come to the temple, where they will stay? If you get staying place, then you can act your brain and improve. And if you are harassed—no place—then brain will not work. Therefore I wanted first of all the residential place. And they criticize me, "Oh, you did not construct temple first." And a temple of the devotees is first, our temple. Then God. God will come if there are devotees. Tatra tiṣṭhāmi nārada yatra gāyantī mad-bhaktāḥ [Padma Purāṅa]. Unless there is devotee, where is God? God is not a stone. Any stone is God? Unless there is devotees, there's no God. Therefore, without devotee, the idol; this is idol worship. That is not worship. Therefore they cannot understand what is the form, what is the distinction between form of the Lord and idol. They do not know how to worship in devotion. Ye yathā māṁ prapadyante [Bg 4.11].
[All of them—as they surrender unto Me—I reward accordingly. Everyone follows My path in all respects, O son of Pṛthā.]
They are thinking, "It is stone, and God is remaining here, stone. He will never speak," because they are not devotee. If you become devotee... Just like Sākṣī Gopāla. For devotee He went to give witness, "Yes, I'll walk." That is God. And if you are not devotee, how you can expect the stone statue is walking? You have read that Sākṣī Gopāla?
Tamāla Kṛṣṅa: Yes, very nice.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Gopāla was saying that "You are asking Me to go to give witness. Do you think a statue can go?" So he is devotee. He said, "Yes, if statue can speak, he can go also." So he had firm faith. So Kṛṣṅa had pledged him, "Yes, I'll go."
Tamāla Kṛṣṅa: I think you also have that firm faith, Prabhupāda.
Prabhupāda: No, without firm faith there is no beginning of God worship.
Devotee: Niṣṭhā.
Prabhupāda:
śraddhā śabde viśvāsa sudṛḍha niścaya kṛṣṅa bhakti kaile sarva-karma kṛta haya [Cc Madhya 22.62]
Do you not read this?
Jayatīrtha: Yes.
Prabhupāda: Śraddhā, this faith, means so strong faith that one will know it perfectly well that simply by worshiping Kṛṣṅa, everything is there. That is the beginning of faith. Otherwise there is no faith. And without faith there is no beginning. Ādau śraddhā. Ādau śraddhā tataḥ sādhu-saṅgaḥ [Cc Madhya 23.14].
[In the beginning there must be faith. Then one becomes interested in associating with pure devotees. Thereafter one is initiated by the spiritual master and executes the regulative principles under his orders. Thus one is freed from all unwanted habits and becomes firmly fixed in devotional service. Thereafter, one develops taste and attachment. This is the way of sādhana-bhakti, the execution of devotional service according to the regulative principles. Gradually emotions intensify, and finally there is an awakening of love. This is the gradual development of love of Godhead for the devotee interested in Kṛṣṅa consciousness.]
If you have got that firm faith, then next stage is to live with, to deal with devotees. Then the faith will increase because by seeing their behavior your faith will be increased. Then bhajana-kriyā.
[shenai sounds again]
Wherefrom this shenai was...?
Sudāmā: Vaikuṅṭhanātha temple.
Prabhupāda: Eh?
Sudama: Originally he came from the Vaikuṅṭhanātha temple, Calcutta.
Tamāla Kṛṣṅa: He's staying up in that...
Bhāvānanda: They're in the front.
Prabhupāda: They are expert in Madras.
Tamāla Kṛṣṅa: Yeah, when we went to Nellore, remember, they were greeting you each time with shenai.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Very good.
Pañcadravida: Very expert in South India.
Prabhupāda: You can engage a company, three, four men, for all the year.
Jayapatāka: So they should... Before maṅgala ārati they should begin playing.
Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. Yes, in Madras.
Tamāla Kṛṣṅa: What is the idea behind this shenai-playing early in the morning?
Prabhupāda: It is very pleasing to hear.
Jayatīrtha: Jaya.
Yaśodānandana: Many temples also in South India, they have all the functions in the morning—waking up the Deity, bathing the Deity, dressing the Deity—they have different shenai tunes for that. Every temple.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Similarly here introduce.
Gurukṛpā: You should play your flute. Tamāla Kṛṣṅa knows how to play the flute.
Prabhupāda: No flute.
Gurukṛpā: He can learn to play the shenai, though.
Prabhupāda: No... Shenai, yes. Very good.
Tamāla Kṛṣṅa: There's a man here that's been here, he knows how to play shenai.
Prabhupāda: Oh.
Tamāla Kṛṣṅa: [indistinct]
Prabhupāda: No, it is not difficult. Anyone can learn. Yes. [break]
Lokanātha: ...playing flute imitates Kṛṣṅa or what?
Prabhupāda: There is no flute. You say simply Kṛṣṅa plays flute and nobody plays?
Lokanātha: You said no playing flute.
Tamāla Kṛṣṅa: Means in the morning.
Prabhupāda: So they are coming here?
Jayapatāka: Circumambulating the temple.
Prabhupāda: That's nice. [break]
Tamāla Kṛṣṅa: ...very colorful with all the devotees. Sādhu-saṅgaḥ really has improved a million times.
Jayapatāka: In South India, Śrīla Prabhupāda, when the ācārya goes out...
Prabhupāda: So you are taking this bamboo down? This?
Jayapatāka: It's already down.
Prabhupāda: No, this down?
Jayapatāka: Hah, down. Cleared out.
Prabhupāda: So it is cleared. You men can live there.
Jayapatāka: Yes.
Devotees in distance: Jaya!
Prabhupāda: Hare Kṛṣṅa. [break]
Jayapatāka: They have big umbrella overhead.
Prabhupāda: Yes, they did it. They did it in South India when I was there.
Tamāla Kṛṣṅa: In Nellore. That was wonderful.
Jayapatāka: We can make such arrangement?
Prabhupāda: Oh, yes.
Jayapatāka: Jaya.
Prabhupāda: Ācāryopāsanam. That is in the Bhagavad-gītā. Ācāryopāsanam [Bg 13.8]. It is not self-aggrandizement. The ācāryopāsanā goes to Kṛṣṅa directly. Therefore it is needed. Not that it is a pompous thing. Ācāryopāsanā. Kṛṣṅa says. That is the way of knowledge. Yasya deve parā bhaktir yathā deve tathā gurau [Śvetāśvatara Upaniṣad 6.23].
[Unto those great souls who have implicit faith in both the Lord and the spiritual master, all the imports of Vedic knowledge are automatically revealed.]
[break]
Pañcadraviḍa: How does that work, that if somebody has the association of a pure devotee for only a lava, one-eleventh of a second, that he attains all perfection?
Prabhupāda: If he is so sincere. Just like dried wood immediately ignites. And if it is moist, it does not. It is the quality of the wood. One takes three hundred years; one in three minutes. That's it. [loud shenai]
Tamāla Kṛṣṅa: You can see them there. [break]
Prabhupāda: One is dry from the material moist of contamination, he becomes immediately ignited in spiritual...
Tamāla Kṛṣṅa: What is that drying process?
Prabhupāda: Drying process is for many, many years one has tried to become Kṛṣṅa conscious, for many, many lives, bahūnāṁ janmanām ante [Bg 7.19].
[After many births and deaths, he who is actually in knowledge surrenders unto Me, knowing Me to be the cause of all causes and all that is. Such a great soul is very rare.]
When he actually becomes man of knowledge he surrenders unto God. Otherwise he is lost. His drying process may take three minute or three millions' years.
Gurukṛpā: But that knowledge that Kṛṣṅa is everything comes by Kṛṣṅa's mercy, Śrīla Prabhupāda?
Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṅa's mercy is already there, but if you are not able to take it...
Pañcadravida: Then you don't even have to hear from a self-realized soul. Simply by seeing him you can become completely purified.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Both required. The matches must be also all right, and the wood must be also. Then there is fire. If one of them is defective, then it will not... But when you go to the fire, you become dry. But willfully we put again water. This nonsense business makes us late. This process is already there, how to become dry. But instead of taking the process, we put water. Then how it will be ignited? The rules and regulations is the drying process. But without following the rules and regulation, if you again become a victimized by māyā, then there is water, and again dry it. So this is going on: watering and drying, watering and drying. No straightforward process for drying. That will help. But difficulty is that we dry, and again water.
Viṣṅujana: Śrīla Prabhupāda, how did Choṭa Haridāsa achieve perfection by killing himself after apparently pouring water on his devotional creeper by talking to a woman?
Prabhupāda: His instance was that even an associate of Caitanya Mahāprabhu can fall down. And if one falls down, his punishment is that: suicide. There is no other punishment. He must commit suicide. This is Caitanya Mahāprabhu's instruc... Otherwise, he is Caitanya Mahāprabhu's personal servant. He cannot fall down. But Caitanya Mahāprabhu showed this instance, that "Even one is My personal servant, he can fall down." And if anyone by any cause he falls down, his punishment is he must commit suicide. This is instruction.
Tamāla Kṛṣṅa: Very strict.
Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. "You have fallen down? You must commit suicide. No more My association."
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṅa: Is that the same as in the Bhagavad-gītā where Kṛṣṅa says, "For one who is honored, dishonor is worse than death"?
Prabhupāda: Yes. That is another thing. But Caitanya Mahāprabhu personally taught this. To be victimized by māyā is possi... There is possibility... Just like Jaya and Vijaya. They were gatekeepers in the Vaikuṅṭha. They also fell down, Hiraṅyakaśipu. So this falldown, there is possibility in any moment because we are very small. We can be captivated by māyā at any moment. Therefore we shall be very, very careful. And if you fall down, then punishment is you make suicide. That's all. Then next life we shall see.
Satsvarūpa: But Śrīla Prabhupāda, in The Nectar of Devotion it says devotional service is so pure that there's no prāyaścitta necessary. Just again engage in your service.
Prabhupāda: Yes. This is not prāyaścitta. This is exemplary punishment. He was not liable to be punished, but they played, that "This is the... This should be done."
Gurukṛpā: He did not kill himself immediately. He waited for a year.
Prabhupāda: He was waiting if Caitanya Mahāprabhu would accept him again. But when he saw that Caitanya Mahāprabhu is not so lenient, he committed suicide. Vajrād api kaṭhora. Harder than the thunderbolt and softer than the rose. This is the position.
Tamāla Kṛṣṅa: But, Prabhupāda, if you were as strict as... If you were that strict...
Prabhupāda: No, I am not Caitanya Prabhu. I am not... Why you are comparing me? I am an ordinary man.
Gurukṛpā: So in ISKCON, if someone falls down, it means that he should commit suicide?
Prabhupāda: No.
Gurudāsa: We wouldn't have much of a movement, then.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṅa: We're too attached to our bodies anyway, Śrīla Prabhupāda.
Prabhupāda: No, no, if he falls down, that is automatically suicide. If he falls down, that means it is suicide. He got the chance. If he falls down, that is suicide.
Gurukṛpā: Spiritual suicide.
Prabhupāda: Spiritual suicide. One gets the chance of becoming eligible for going back to home, back to Godhead, and if he commits mistake and it is stopped, is it not suicide?
Gurukṛpā: You once gave the example, Śrīla Prabhupāda, of taking your plane off the ground and then bringing it back to land again.
Prabhupāda: Eh?
Gurukṛpā: You once gave the example that you take your plane to a destination, and you have to turn around and come back and start all over again, take off again.
Prabhupāda: There are so many. Dṛḍha-vrata. Bhajante mam dṛḍha-vrata. So we should be very strong-minded and continue our devotional service very strongly. [greets devotees:] Hare Kṛṣṅa.
Tamāla Kṛṣṅa: [aside:] Garga-money, not Gargamuni. He's doing some transaction. [laughter]
Prabhupāda: Garga means...
Jayatīrtha: I think he went to see about the electricity. He said that he was going to go early this morning to see about the electricity, why it is always going off.
Prabhupāda: Oh, garga, garga means "big jug," and "money," full of money. Big jug full of coins. Formerly they used to...
Tamāla Kṛṣṅa: Keep.
Prabhupāda: No. Cheat the government. There was no income tax, but still they used to keep in big, big jugs all gold coins and put into the..., underneath the ground. Nobody could understand where is the money. Very easy thing.
Pañcadravida: Hoarders.
Prabhupāda: And he did not disclose at the time of death; then it remained. And then, after some years, somebody digging, he got.
Tamāla Kṛṣṅa: There's a nice example given in Nectar of Devotion about the digging for a treasure.
Prabhupāda: Hmm? Yes. [break] ...shenai on the gate, that is nice. Jayapatāka?
Tamāla Kṛṣṅa: Jayapatāka.
Jayapatāka: Yes, Śrīla Prabhupāda?
Prabhupāda: They should play shenai on the gate, and here kīrtana will go on. Not that kīrtana will be stopped to hear their dundubhi.
Tamāla Kṛṣṅa: Shenai is not a replacement for kīrtana.
Prabhupāda: No. Shenai is meant for... That is navadhana. That is called navadhana. [break] ...must be played. Not this dundubhi. They are playing as a dundubhi. That will not work. And along with shenai they can play.
Madhudviṣa: Getting his reeds together.
Prabhupāda: Hmm?
Madhudviṣa: Getting his reeds together. [shenai starts]
Devotee: There he goes. [laughing] [break]
Tamāla Kṛṣṅa: They're accusing you of being businessman.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Jayapatāka: We are selling Bhāgavatam; they are selling fish.
Prabhupāda: Yes. We are selling Bhāgavatam; they are selling fish. [laughs] [end]
